At what point were you able to making a living off tattooing?

I think I was able to do that a few years into it. That really happened when I started working at Primal Urge. I paid the rent before that, but I wasn't ever really making good money. All the pieces I wanted to work on, I always did really cheap. I remember when I was potentially going to work at Primal Urge and Marcus and I were going through my portfolio. He would ask me what I was charging, and I'd tell him $100 or $200. He was like, “You've got to charge more!” I'm sure I had 40 tattoos in my portflio, and they were all from the size of your palm to half-sleeves. I added up what I charged for all of the tattoos, and it was a little over $3,000 for every tattoo in the book. [Laughs] To my credit, it was nothing that I planned. That's what you do when you love doing something.

How do you feel about the tattoo TV shows?

I definitely think it's detrimental. It's a horrible tattoo education for the general public. It's some fucking TV show with an agenda from producers who don't give a fuck or know jack shit about anything. The whole goal is to make a product that is going to be the most appealing to the most numb-minded people because they want to have Snickers buy their ads. It's a bunch of bullshit. Does tattooing need a TV show? No. It doesn't need it at all. Not even a tiny fraction. It's not like they're doing a bunch of really horrible work. But it doesn't do anything that tattooing needs.

What about the Ed Hardy clothing line?

Does that serve tattooing? I don't know. I think it's going to have a slight backlash because it's going to be oversaturated with Ed's designs. Maybe people will start to be a little bit tired of it and people will rebel against it. Maybe in five years people won't want as many Ed-type designs. They'll push for something else. Or maybe tattooing will slow down a little bit. I can only assume it will anyway as the shows and tattoo-related cultural stuff has run its course. Right now, you have so many people throwing a crappy skull, a swallow, an anchor, and a rose on a shirt. Everything has tattoo imagery on it now. It's reached a peak. But tattooing has lasted since the beginning of time. This isn't going to kill it.

You collect vintage skateboards. What's the pride of your collection?

I think my favorite is an old Natas Kaupas. I have an old Natas from SMA. That's probably my favorite board because it's a board that I've liked since I was a kid. At this point, I only have a few boards left that I really want. There's a Black Flag deck that was made by Rip City and says “No Net Ever.” And I want the World Industries Rodney Mullen “Rock Is King” board. I'm interested in any unused, vintage skateboards. I will move someone to the front of my two-year waiting list and work a fair trade for the board or simply pay them well for it.

So if I walk into your shop with one of those decks, I can get some tattoo time in trade?

Damn straight. Oh, yeah. We'll make a party on
your skin.